AOH :: NRGCOIL.TXT Free Energy via Ring Coil?
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Newsgroups: alt.sci.physics.new-theories
Subject: Free energy via ring coil ?
Date: Thu Oct  7 19:06:00 1993

>
> Guten Tag!

Hi, You are welcome !
Guten Tag !

>
> Remember that bifilar wire has two conductors. If I wind one coil with
> bifilar wire, I have two ends. Each end has _two_ conductors. I only wound
> _one_ coil, but I wound it with _two_ conductors. Both conductors were wound
> at the same time. Since there are two conductors, there are two coils.

.  .               .
.     . coil A   .      .     coil wound with bifilar wire
.          .      .    + +   .
.    +  +     .  .    +     +   . conductor #1
+      +         +         +
+         +      +             +  conductor#2
+            +  +
coil B
>
>
> I think I know what was omitted from the original description. A coil is
> wound with bifilar wire so that the ends meet at one end of the coil. _Then
> conductor #1 at one end is connected to conductor #2 on the other end_.
> _Now_ there is one coil. Connecting a tap to the junction of the two
> conductors gives two counterwound coils. It would have been simpler to
> describe the coil wound with a single conductor, but I am with you now.
>

Okay, I see, now I understand your method ! :-)

> If we pass a magnet through the two coils, we see voltages of opposite
> polarity across the load resistors (not shown).
>
>    		/ \  *------------ (+V)
>      winding     | *
>      direction   |   * *
>      of A          *      coil A
>   		     * *
>  		   *
>  		     *------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN
> 	           *
>      winding         * *
>      direction   | *      coil B
>      of B	 |   * *
>  	        \ /*
>  		     *------------- (-V)
>
> Since the voltages are opposite in sign, likewise the magnetic fields
> produced by the load current are of opposite sign.
>
> _However_ the winding directions are also opposite. This turns the magnetic
> fields 180 degrees with respect to each other. Now they are no longer
> opposing each other, but adding, and they now combine to brake the movement
> of the magnet.
>
> Eric
>
>
>

Hmm, I must disagree !

When you make the coils like this, what you have done:

Scheme 1:

.  .               .
.      . coil A   .      .     coil wound with bifilar wire
.          .      .    + +   .
.    +  +     .  .    +     +   . conductor #1  +Voltage
|  +      +         +         +
\         +      +             +  conductor#2  -Voltage
tap        +  +
coil B

If you put now a DC voltage into it only at the conductor #1 and #2 end,
this coil will generate _no_ magnetic field ! (Now assuming no moving magnet
nearby, just energizing the coil as a test!)
It will cancel the magnetic field itsself !  Is this okay with you ?

I hope yes. BTW, will it be a normal ohmic resistor this way or will it
also have an inductance ? (so that the current builds up only after a delay,
due to the R - L pole ?)

Okay, second part:

Sheme 2:

/ \  *------------ (+V)   ---------------------|
winding     | *                                         --|--    |
direction   |   * *                          Resistor1  |   |    |
of A          *      coil A                            |---|    |
* *                                       |     \|/
*                                           |
*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Current
*                                           |      Flow
winding         * *                                     --|--    |
direction   | *      coil B                  Resistor2  |   |    |
of B	 |   * *                                     |---|    |
\ /*                                           |     \|/
*------------- (-V)-----------------------|

If you now compare sheme 2 to sheme 1, you will realize, that the
current is flowing in sheme 2 into the same direction as in sheme 1
and thus the magnetic fields would cancel themselfs !

Or am I making something wrong ?

If you look from the TOP side view, then the bifilar coil looks something
like this ( If I could paint as good as you with ASCII graphics.....) :-)
if you only look at one loop:

* * *
*       *
*   .. .  *
*  .    .  * ------- + Voltage
*  :      \_________ - Voltage
*  :
*  . . .* ---------- tap (0 Volt)
*  *

If you now take the "right hand rule" to get the magnetic fields _inside_
the coil, you will see, that it cancels the magnetic fields !

Now, where am I wrong ?
Can you see the error...? It seems to be too easy, that it really could
work to extract free energy this way ?

Best regards, Stefan.

## CrossPoint v2.1 ##
Empfaenger : WHITESEL%BIZET.NOSC.MIL@USENET.ZER
Betreff    : Re^2: free energy via bifilar coils ?
Absender   : HARTI@HARTI.ZER
Datum      : Do 07.10.93, 23:54  (erhalten: 07.10.93)
Groesse    : 8777 Bytes
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Das war eine gute Idee, to add the current flow -

:-)
Okay !

/ \  *------------ (+V)   ---------------------|
winding     | *                                         --|--    |
direction   |   * *                          Resistor1  |   |    |
of A          *      coil A                            |---|    |
* *                                       |     \|/
*                                           |
*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Current
*                                           |      Flow
winding         * *                                     --|--    |
direction   | *      coil B                  Resistor2  |   |    |
of B	 |   * *                                     |---|    |
\ /*                                           |     \|/
*------------- (-V)-----------------------|

I see that I missed a sign change, and my diagram was incorrect :-(

I see..

Suppose the two windings were not opposite in direction, but instead were two
identical coils connected in series:

*------------ (+V)   ---------------------|
winding     | *                                          _|_     |
direction   |   * *                          Resistor1  |   |    |
of A      \ /*       coil A                            |___|    |
* *                                       |     \|/
*                                           |
*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Current
*                                           |      Flow
winding         * *                                      _|_     |
direction   | *      coil B                  Resistor2  |   |    |
of B	 |   * *                                     |___|    |
\ /*                                           |     \|/
*------------- (-V)-----------------------|

A DC potential across the two ends produces a magnetic field, and a magnet
passing through the coils would generate the current flow shown. Now let's
separate the coils to keep better track:

*------------ (+V)   ---------------------|
winding     | *                                         --|--    |
direction   |   * *                          Resistor1  |   |    |
of A      \ /*      coil A                             |---|    |
* *                                       |     \|/
*                                           |      Current
*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Flow

*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Current
*                                           |      Flow
winding         * *                                     --|--    |
direction   | *      coil B                  Resistor2  |   |    |
of B	 |   * *                                     |---|    |
\ /*                                           |     \|/
*------------- (-V)-----------------------|

If we reverse one coil with respect to the other:

/ \  *------------ (-V)   ---------------------|     /|\
winding     | *                                         --|--    |
direction   |   * *                          Resistor1  |   |    |
of A          *      coil A                            |---|    |
* *                                       |      |
*                                           |      Current
*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Flow

*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Current
*                                           |      Flow
winding         * *                                     --|--    |
direction   | *      coil B                  Resistor2  |   |    |
of B	 |   * *                                     |---|    |
\ /*                                           |     \|/
*------------- (-V)-----------------------|

Reconnect the coils:

/ \  *------------ (-V)   ---------------------|     /|\
winding     | *                                         --|--    |
direction   |   * *                          Resistor1  |   |    |
of A          *      coil A                            |---|    |
* *                                       |      |
*                                           |      Current
*------------- (TAP) COMMON RETURN -------|      Flow
*                                           |
winding         * *                                     --|--    |
direction   | *      coil B                  Resistor2  |   |    |
of B	 |   * *                                     |---|    |
\ /*                                           |     \|/
*------------- (-V)-----------------------|

This is the bifilar configuration. A DC potential across the two ends produces
cancelling magnetic fields, and a magnet passing through the coils would
generate the current flow shown. As you said, the current flow shown in my
incorrect diagram would produce cancelling magnetic fields. In this corrected
diagram, the fields add. Bitte Entschuldigung!

Hmm, it seems you are right and now I understand it....

Too bad it does not work....
Can you imagine any other setup, where the magnet would not be slowed down
by the generated magnetic fields ?

I also have another idea, where I don't know, how it would work:

Here it is, I have to draw it again:

Sorry, I just don't have the time to make this circle look more like a
good circle... :-)

Let us assume this time we use a electric energized ring magnet coil with an
empty plastic body like this. I only show it from the top view side,
with showing only the empty plastic body:

*  * *  *   *
*    ___________   *
*      /             \    *
/                  \     *
*   *        \      *
*             *           *        \    Magnetic Flux direction
*                  *      _\|    *
*                       *
*         *                             *             *
*                                  *
*                                       *
*       *                                          *         *
*                                             *
*                                               *
*                                                 *       *
*     *                                                 *
*                                                 *
*                                                *
*        *                                             *        *
*                                         *
*                                      *          *
*                                  *
*         *                              *           *
*                         *
*                   *           *
*            *   *    *   *
Permanent magnet car ---> N =======S               *
*    N =======S           *
*    *     *    *

Now we put a permament magnet inside the plastic body, sitting in a
tiny plastic car, so that it could go round inside the coil.

Now if we energize this coil by putting a voltage accross the coil
(this time only one coil, no bifilar coil, just a normal one),

1. would the tiny car move, due to that the permanent magnet is pushed away
and attracted by the coil's magnetic ring flux ?

2. If the magnet is running around in the plastic car inside the coil in
circles, does this draw additional current from the power source from which
the coil is energized ?

Instead of a coil, made out of wire and being energized, also permanent
magnets could be used, that produce this kind of flux inside the plastic
body. Then it should be possible to let the card run only on the inter-
action of permanent magnetic fields  !

Thus we might tap the zero-point energy via the magnetic field generation
of a permanent magnet.

So would in the above setup the permanent magnet car run around
inside the ring ?

Wiedersehen,
Eric

Regards, Stefan.

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